Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: You're listening to the fostering together podcast. And on today's episode, we are going to share information and discuss the different types of care that's available within the out of home care sector across Australia. So stay tuned.
Hello and welcome to the podcast. I'm Brendan.
[00:00:29] Speaker B: And I'm Tracy.
[00:00:30] Speaker A: And we are fostering together. Tracy, you're rolling your eyes. You don't like that new intro, do you?
[00:00:36] Speaker B: It's fine, Brendan. It's fine.
[00:00:38] Speaker A: We're going with it. Tracy lets me do these things from time to time. So, Tracy, we've. It's only been a couple of weeks since we released our first episode, and we're not. We've strictly put no specific timeframe around this in regularity because carers who know a bit about caring timeframes and sticking to timeframes and schedules can be pretty tough when we've got children in our care. So. And that's happened in the last four weeks. We've got a little one with us.
[00:01:04] Speaker B: It has. We started without a little one, and then we got a little one, so we were a bit Mia, but that's because we had this new little one. And we just spent the last two weeks sort of getting to know her, getting to know her routine, trying to get her into a routine.
I think we're there. She's in bed, and we're podcasting, and.
[00:01:24] Speaker A: Our adult children are in other places at boyfriends and girlfriend's place. So we're covered.
[00:01:30] Speaker B: We're covered.
[00:01:31] Speaker A: Cats in the garage locked out.
[00:01:32] Speaker B: Cats been locked away because. Making too much noise.
[00:01:35] Speaker A: So, all going well, we should have very limited interruptions in this recording. Is that right?
[00:01:40] Speaker B: Fingers crossed.
[00:01:41] Speaker A: Means a little bit less editing for me, hopefully. So, Tracy, let's dive into our topic, because this is something that we didn't really understand.
Amounts or the different types of care that were available when we first ventured into this foster care process?
[00:01:57] Speaker B: No, not at all. I just sort of knew what foster care was. Googled an agency, and we went to an open evening. And I think we're in the right program. It suits us. We were lucky. But there are different sort of programs that suit different people to how much time they can give to fostering.
[00:02:16] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. And I guess, again, we spoke on episode one, but your journey around fostering and being in touch with this, in your mind, has been a long time, so you had some perspective on what type of care you'd like to provide and sort of brought me along for the ride. So that's how we sort of made this decision. Or fell into the type of care that we do and the part of the program we're involved in, which we'll touch on. But we're going to start with the type of care that we learned about not long ago, and it's called temporary. A temporary care arrangement.
[00:02:47] Speaker B: A TCA.
[00:02:49] Speaker A: A TCA. Do you want to tell us a little bit about that?
[00:02:51] Speaker B: So a TCA is an arrangement made by community services that provides temporary care for a child other than family.
So to be in a TCA, there are two different ways. So a child needs to be in concern. So the community services must believe that the child needs care and protection. But maybe that child's not quite ready to be taken away, that there's something they can do. Maybe the child is lives in a house where there's a hoarder situation going on, so they can make an arrangement with the parents to go into a TCA. A TCA lasts for three months, it can be extended to six months, and there is always a restoration plan back to the parents that they're consenting to. So it's just a fact of, let's put your child into a another family for the moment while you mentally get yourself ready, do what you need to do, and then we can look at the restoration plan, or it can just be that a parent's going into surgery, they've got no friends or family to look after their child. This is something that would help them. So, like I said, there must be a restoration plan. It goes for three months, which can be extended to six months, but after that, something needs to happen, and so the child will go back to the parents.
[00:04:17] Speaker A: A decision needs to be made.
[00:04:19] Speaker B: Yeah. Child will go into care, or a child can age out if there happened to be a young person that's older, but it's not a short term foster placement, because at the end of that six months, it may be decided that they're not able to go home and the best place for them to stay would be with you. And it sort of turned into then a TFC temporary family care arrangement. You don't really want to chop and change the children around.
[00:04:47] Speaker A: They've then formally come into a child protection situation and they will start to move through the system. So I guess what we've got to stress with what we learned about the temporary care arrangement, which was a fairly new learning for us in the last six weeks, is that it is a voluntary arrangement with the parent or parents.
[00:05:06] Speaker B: That the child could be returned if the parents, after a week say, no, this isn't working for me. I want my child returned. They have that option.
[00:05:13] Speaker A: Absolutely. So I'm with you. When we first heard about this, we liked the idea. It's not something we'd heard about before. Our agency and DCJ have agreed to sort of extend this type of care, and our agency will be involved in running some of that. We haven't experienced that firsthand yet, but it seems to be an opportunity, if done well, where, like you alluded to, people can work with the parents to help them or parent get back on track, whatever that means.
[00:05:41] Speaker B: The child has to be taken into care. That doesn't always have to happen. Sometimes somebody just needs a little bit of help.
[00:05:47] Speaker A: Absolutely. And I think we experienced that with our very, very first place, and which I'm sure we'll talk about at some point in future episodes, but not saying at that time, but over the course of two to four years, that these children were that age, that there really felt like, from our experience, that they were young parents that just needed a guiding hand, they needed a lot of support, a lot of help on the ground. So maybe something like that could have helped them a lot and helped their children not go into care.
[00:06:13] Speaker B: Yeah, I think it's good. It's good, but it's not. Even though it's three to six months, if at the end of that three months or six months, they decide that they need to be brought into care, obviously it's going to be another year, maybe two years. It's not something to jump into thinking it's just a three, six month placement.
[00:06:33] Speaker A: Absolutely, absolutely. So let's go on to the next stage of care. And this is not necessary, a follow on from a temporary care arrangement, because that normally goes to TFC, a temporary family care arrangement, which is, like you said, but let's talk a little about emergency care. So our understanding of emergency care is that it's really short term care provided when children, or a child needs an immediate placement due to a crisis or an urgent situation. So that child or children are deemed to be in some sort of danger. It's been identified by the local government agency and they are taken away. And even if it's not a formal placement for them to go into yet, they are put into some sort of safer arrangement.
[00:07:17] Speaker B: So, yeah, children and young people, short notice, evenings, weekends, placements can be up to one night, a few days or up to twelve weeks. I don't believe this is done by the agencies. I believe this is done in New South Wales by just DCJ thinking about it.
[00:07:34] Speaker A: So our current little person who's with us, the d little thing that happened just on the easter weekend, didn't it? So she was actually put into emergency care before she came to us?
[00:07:46] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:07:46] Speaker A: So I think the key. One of the key benefits, or I think the key benefit is that it's an immediate opportunity to remove a child that is in a vulnerable position and an unsafe position into a safer position in care.
[00:08:00] Speaker B: Yeah, maybe it's the middle of the night, you can't find a care. You have special carers that would take emergency children in.
[00:08:07] Speaker A: Yep. And I guess the downside of that is like, that's a, you know, the whole world changes for that child in an instant. You know, a lot of these children will not have any idea about what's going on because of their age or anything like that. So it's quite a. That would be quite a disruptive process and then create its own level of trauma, I'd imagine.
[00:08:25] Speaker B: Absolutely. That's why there's some great carers out there.
[00:08:28] Speaker A: Is there anything else we need to say about emergency care? Just to give people a bit of a flavour of what this is?
[00:08:34] Speaker B: Not really go to DCJ. They're the ones that deal with it. For one of the shorter foster cares. This one is it. You're really just taking them quickly, overnight, couple of days, like it says, maybe up to twelve weeks.
[00:08:49] Speaker A: Let's go to our next type of care, which is short term care or what we know with our agency as temporary family care. TFC.
[00:08:59] Speaker B: TFC.
[00:09:00] Speaker A: So this is. I feel like this is your baby, because this is exactly the type of care that you've always wanted to get into for many, many years. So tell us a bit about what TFC or temporary family care or short term care is TFC.
[00:09:12] Speaker B: Temporary family care is you look after the child. When they've been taken away from their families, for whatever reason by DCJ, they will come to. To us and they could be with us from two weeks to two years. And I have heard of placements longer. I have heard of three year placement. There's a lot that goes on that we won't get into today. What happens. There's a lot of court cases, the process that follows too, investigations.
It takes time, especially if restoration is planned. The parents have to be given time to start their journey of whatever they need to do. Sometimes family has to be found. That's why they're with you for this certain amount of time. So we get them, we help them, you get them into therapies, all of that. Obviously, this is the one we know the most. This is what we do every day, but I think it's the most common foster place where I think it is.
[00:10:12] Speaker A: The thing that we've got to reiterate, or really the strong message we're to get through here, is that the TFC or that short term care arrangement, again, fairly loose on short term, it can be months to two years and we have heard of longer placements. But what we understand in New South Wales is the legislation says that an order, court order, must be given about the long term plan for that child's care or the children's care within a two year period. Again, doesn't always sort of abide by that, but it is care provided or a child, or children come into care in that TFC side whilst the process is being undertaken to determine what will be the long term care plan for that child, or children will have the.
[00:10:55] Speaker B: Child from the day they leave their family and come into your care until the day that final orders or restoration has been deemed possible.
So you will have them that whole time. So you'll either help them be restored back to mum and dad or their family, or you'll help them go to permanent care.
[00:11:16] Speaker A: And like you said before, that at least we know through our agency and we believe this is a focus across the board, is that the number one priority is restoration. With birth parent or birth parents or.
[00:11:27] Speaker B: Family, it's always restoration first. That's what they work towards, restoration, which is great.
[00:11:34] Speaker A: I agree. I think it's great in the first instance, but I also. We also know in the short time we've been as carers that it may not always be the best, best option for a child.
[00:11:44] Speaker B: Unfortunately, it's not, but it has to be explored.
[00:11:48] Speaker A: Anything else we want to share just at this point about short term care or temporary family care?
[00:11:53] Speaker B: No, obviously, we can just carry on talking about it because it's the one we know. But basically they come into your care straight away and they'll stay in your care until final orders or restitution.
[00:12:03] Speaker A: And what we loved about this type of care and why we chose this, and again, you were the driving force behind this, is that we love that opportunity. If restoration does happen with birth parent or birth parents, if we can help restore a family and reconnect a family, then that's our ideal outcome. Unfortunately, we know, we don't know exactly the stats, but unfortunately that is a very rare occasion. It would seem it is.
[00:12:28] Speaker B: It's something they're working harder on, though, giving parents more support, all of that. But we've also made some beautiful families, haven't we? Yeah.
[00:12:37] Speaker A: Yeah. It's definitely a very, very pleasing part of the process.
And we're very, very fortunate to be connected with those lovely families. And they've been very, very kind to us to have them include them, include us as part of their extended family.
[00:12:51] Speaker B: I suppose you could say it's been beautiful.
[00:12:53] Speaker A: Absolutely. Shout out to those people. They know who they are. Let's move on to our next type of care. Tracy. So on my list here is what we call permanent or long term care. What I understand permanent long term care is care where a child is living with foster families until they reach adulthood. So without the expectation of returning to birth families. So this can extend from if a child who might be six months old goes into long term or permanent care, then they could be. The expectation is they would be placed with that family until that term age out of the system. And in New South Wales now, and I think across the board in Australia, that's 21.
[00:13:36] Speaker B: Yes. So, I mean, all children will go on to permanent care, but that can mean adoption as well. But they'll go to permanent care and then the adoption process will be taken. It's just getting long term care for those children.
Some can't be adopted for different reasons and it's just trying to find a long term placement, hopefully till the 21 again.
[00:14:00] Speaker A: The benefits for something like that is that there's stability, you know, hopefully anyway, you know, we've certainly heard of long term care and permanent placements breaking down. That unfortunately does happen, but generally it provides a level of stability for the child or children. They feel part of a family. They're treated, not that we treat the beautiful young people in our care any different to family, but they're really part of the family and they've got that safety, security over the long term. They're not wondering in their head about how long am I going to be here and where am I going to move to next?
[00:14:30] Speaker B: Yeah, I hope so. I hope so. I really don't know enough about permanent care. This is where lovely followers can fill us in because I really don't know enough to know that because that sounds like the dream.
[00:14:44] Speaker A: We want to give our listeners and people new to caring and maybe even interested in caring. We just want to give people an overview of what the different types of care so people feel a little bit more empowered about. Hey, this type of care feels like it worked for me because I know, again, me naive me before you explaining and us going to information session, I didn't really have any idea about the types of care that was available at all, and there's so many as we're going through, you're a little bit more indirect than what I am around some of the issues around this. I think one of the things for me, and again, I think this is another episode in some detail, but what frustrates me a lot, particularly in Australia, or I guess we're talking NSW specifically, is that when a. A child with indigenous background comes into care and they may go into permanent care, and the hope is that some adoption happens, but the reality is that what we've learnt, children with aboriginal heritage, or indigenous heritage, if there's no aboriginal families to adopt, then basically they can generally spend their life in care and not be adopted by a family. And I think that's crazy.
[00:15:49] Speaker B: That's what we're hearing. We will cover it and do a lot more deep diving into the situation and what happens, but it's been our knowledge so far that they can't be adopted by anyone other than an indigenous family.
[00:16:07] Speaker A: I'd love to be proven wrong, but that's what we. That's what we know. That's what we. Well, that's what we understand.
[00:16:11] Speaker B: That's what we understand.
[00:16:12] Speaker A: So certainly reaching out to people in the community or listening to this, if you know somebody who is an expert in that space, please reach out to us and let us know and we'll be more than happy to have you on the podcast so you can set the records. But all the conversations we've had of people within the system, this is the basic outcome that we have been led to believe.
[00:16:31] Speaker B: If you're a indigenous family and you're thinking of fostering, please do it.
[00:16:35] Speaker A: Put your hand up, because there's certainly a need for it. Absolutely, absolutely.
[00:16:39] Speaker B: We really need you to put your hands up.
[00:16:41] Speaker A: I think one of the potential downsides of permanent care is that there is that possibility that ties with the birth family can be severed, can be stopped, not deliberately, but just by child not being sort of connected too much with their original family.
[00:16:59] Speaker B: I think the same sort of rules apply where, you know, you have court mandated visits and things like that, which can go on until they're 18.
[00:17:09] Speaker A: As we know, they don't always happen.
[00:17:11] Speaker B: And I mean, I'm sure there are some permanent families, permanent care families that work very closely with still.
[00:17:18] Speaker A: Alright, let's go on to our next type of care, which is kinship care. Kinship care is, again, we're not sitting here with all the statistics in front of us, but from what we understand from some of these experts in the system, that that is a big part of the foster care system, kinship carers, and a big part of the approved carers, actually, particularly in New South Wales, kinship care. So do you want to tell us a little bit about kinship care?
[00:17:46] Speaker B: So kinship is when the child goes with family, but it's not just family, it's anybody in their community that they already know. It could be a teacher, a guide or a scout leader, someone like that, someone they know and someone that is willing to take them in. So it's not just family, it's someone in their community as well. And this is the most preferred option that especially DCJ would like to see happen. They're with someone that they know they're still in their community.
[00:18:19] Speaker A: Again, one of our placements, we did know a couple of grandparents that did have kinship care arrangements for a couple of their grandchildren, and they've taken on, or one of them was guardianship and the other one moving into a guardianship.
[00:18:32] Speaker B: So there are many, many grandparents out there. Absolutely, mum and dad.
[00:18:37] Speaker A: And a call out to all of those people, because they are absolutely, you know, carers are just everyday heroes in my books, but kinship carers and those grandparents that take on the role as not only grandparents, parents are just absolutely superheroes. What was new to me, and I know to you, and let's reinforce to our listeners that kinship care does not mean that a child or children has to be placed with family.
[00:19:05] Speaker B: As you said, it's the word kin, isn't it? It gets you. It got us.
[00:19:08] Speaker A: We thought it was family. First of all, we were very surprised when we heard it's not just family. So anybody who has some sort of, I guess, can we say, reasonable connection to the family and has known the child or children and there is some sort of bond there, then they can take on that kinship role.
[00:19:24] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:19:25] Speaker A: So just reinforcing that, just because you are not birth family, if you are connected to a family that is having these sort of challenges in their life and children being taken away, you may be approached because you have a bond with that family and with that child or children as a kinship carer option. So. And again, I think if. If restoration to birth parent or birth parents is not always possible, and unfortunately, in most occasions it's not, then definitely kinship care would seem to be a great option.
[00:19:54] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:19:55] Speaker A: How about we move to respite care?
[00:19:57] Speaker B: Respite care. Every foster carer loves a respite care.
[00:20:04] Speaker A: I guess you can say that, and it is true. There's a bit of a joke around, isn't it?
[00:20:08] Speaker B: It's very hard to get, though.
[00:20:10] Speaker A: Very hard to get. I guess for us. One of the things that I found this is just you and I. Like, we thrive off supporting people, and certainly we need space. We need a bit of time for ourself. And that's where you and I work as a team. We've got a bit of a, I guess, logistical process in place where I do certain things in the morning. I get home by a certain time, most of the time, and you're able to do your thing and then we can get into our day and we can feed off each other. I'm lucky enough to work from home.
[00:20:35] Speaker B: Yeah. When we're lucky enough, we also have adult children.
[00:20:39] Speaker A: Absolutely.
[00:20:40] Speaker B: That can now help us. So we haven't actually experienced a time when we've actually needed respite or wanted it. But there are actually.
[00:20:46] Speaker A: We're sort of giving each other respite, aren't we?
[00:20:48] Speaker B: We are. But there are a lot of single carers out there. A lot.
[00:20:53] Speaker A: We know a lot of them, and they are unbelievable people as well, aren't they?
[00:20:57] Speaker B: Yes, you are amazing.
[00:20:59] Speaker A: Yep.
[00:20:59] Speaker B: So respite is taking a child children sibling group for maybe a weekend, once a month school holidays, when you can really, I mean, you can do once, once a month, once first weekend of a month, every, every month, or just through the school holidays, just to give a foster family a break.
[00:21:22] Speaker A: And once again, through our involvement over the last few years, those kinship carers we spoke about that they have an arrangement with, I guess, the other side of the family who are approved respite carers for the two little ones. So they older people, they certainly need a break from time to time. Looking after a couple of little ones is pretty full on for people of any age.
[00:21:42] Speaker B: And the single carers, when they have sibling groups, it's just nice to have a weekend to do what they need to do sometimes.
[00:21:50] Speaker A: And it's something that we sort of tentatively put our hand up when we've said that when we haven't got other children in our care, that we would help other members in our community that we know on the central coast, that we're more than happy to do some respite care from time to time, because we do know a lot of single carers in our community group, don't we?
[00:22:08] Speaker B: Absolutely.
[00:22:09] Speaker A: So respite care really, in summary, is giving some relief, I guess. Can we call it a bit of a sleepover for kids to some extent, but there still is an approval process. You still need to be an approved respite carer, you are able to give relief to a permanent or a carer who generally has the care of that child of children twenty four, seven.
[00:22:29] Speaker B: And it's getting to know them, not just doing it once in a blue moon, maybe like the once a month, the school holidays, getting that bond with them as well.
[00:22:38] Speaker A: It sort of feels like it could be like a, you know, I guess I'm going a bit old school here, but a dad coming home from work and having all the fun with the kid. When Mum's been, you know, again, I'm being older, mum's been at home doing all the discipline and stuff, and dad comes in with the chocolates and he's sort of having fun and stuff. So maybe respite carers can be a little bit like that at times. They can do all the fun stuff.
[00:22:57] Speaker B: They are, they are, absolutely.
[00:22:59] Speaker A: I apologise if I've offended anybody, but just by going back to old school and mum dad scenarios. But, hey, don't be offended too much. Let's look at our last topic or our last type of care. And this is one that I've learned a little bit.
[00:23:14] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm gonna show this one to you because you know more about this one.
[00:23:17] Speaker A: Well, let's hope so. It's called specialist foster care and the only organisation that I'm aware of, I'm sure there are more, but the organisation that I'm aware of, particularly in New South Wales, is called professional individualised care, and that's run by a very, very astute chap called Jared Wheatley. And he'd spent I can't remember how many years, but quite a number of years over in Germany, learning a lot about this professionalised care model and it's really relational care and it's one on one care. So that specialist foster care is actually full time. So the carers are employed by this organisation, pick professional individualised care as full time carers. They're paid a full time wage so that they can put 100% of their effort into the care and nurturing and the protection of that child in their care. So we're all specially trained, but these guys, from my understanding, given that they're full time, the level of training that they go through and that they need, because they are dealing with children who have significant sort of medical, behavioural or disability needs. So really, the usage around that and why that's required is when a child requires that more intensive care and supervision than probably what a typical standard foster care arrangement could have. I can't remember from Jarrod the level of percentage of care that that equates to, but my understanding or remembrance from that situation or from that conversation is that it's really still a very, very small percentage of the carer population in Australia or in New South Wales, but certainly in, like all foster carers, in very high need, because there's a lot of children, unfortunately, in care that do have very high needs, and not all carers are equipped to take on that sort of responsibility. Really good benefit in that one on one relational care provides really targeted support and care for the children with their specific needs and they are treated, trained around those specific needs. So, sounds like a growing sector, I think. Apparently it does wonders in Germany, which is a leading area for this type of care, according to what Jared shared with me. So connect with Jarrad Wheatley on LinkedIn. If you're on LinkedIn, learn a bit about pic. Professional, professional, individualised care, and that might be something that may resonate with people listening to the podcast.
[00:25:39] Speaker B: Yeah, it sounds great, doesn't it?
[00:25:41] Speaker A: Yeah, look, he's doing great things. I know he's talking to government agencies. Again, I don't want to misspeak, but all I know is his organisation and the care that they have created, the care model they bought from Europe to Australia, it is saving the New South Wales government tens of millions of dollars per annum in the type of care they're able to arrange, as opposed to some of these other care arrangements that are taking place.
[00:26:07] Speaker B: That's great. No targets left behind. I mean, one thing we should say is there are many, many, many children in out of home care at the moment. They're in hotels, different accommodations, just. They just don't have the care, enough carers to look after these children.
[00:26:25] Speaker A: It's scary to think, isn't it, that, you know, a young one is, or any age, but any age, you know, there's kids that have. There have been stories about it in the news of late where, you know, young ones have been in hotel rooms for a long time and say, a long time, you know, one to two years, and they've just had carer rotation, you know, staff, and not knocking those staff, it's a role that they play, but they're coming through and these child just. These children are just seeing different carers coming in and out on a roster, looking after them, and they don't really see much.
[00:26:55] Speaker B: They need to get as many foster carers into the system as possible.
[00:26:59] Speaker A: Absolutely. So, look, if you are thinking about caring and if this episode resonated with you today, just in regards to the different types of care that is available out there.
[00:27:08] Speaker B: Well, I think we should say where do you go best is to get on Google and search the different agencies in your area and talk to them. Go to information nights. Also, remember, DCJ have their own carers as well, so it's another one to explore. But there are many different agencies and there are different ones in New South Wales, Queensland, West Australia, etcetera. So wherever you are, get on Google, search them, pick up the phone to them, talk to them, go to the information nights and see what's best for you.
[00:27:41] Speaker A: Everything's just a Google away, or is everything just a chat GPT away nowadays? I'm not sure. A Google. A google. A Google, yeah. I don't know. I think chat GPT gives better information than Google, to be honest. But it's another story.
[00:27:52] Speaker B: Google will just bring up the agencies.
[00:27:54] Speaker A: Yes, it will, yes. So get in touch with your agency. There's informationites out there and the other thing is you can email us, you can contact us and we can give you some guidance there that's directly with us. Our email address is Tracy. Do you remember it?
[00:28:06] Speaker B: No.
[00:28:07] Speaker A: Brendanosteringtogether au well, my name's not there.
[00:28:12] Speaker B: So how am I going to remember that?
[00:28:14] Speaker A: Well, we put it under my name because we know how terrible you are at answering emails.
[00:28:19] Speaker B: Just email us with any questions, any advice or any what we've been talking about today. If you've got any more information, you've got correct information. Hopefully we've given you all the correct information. But if you know any more you want to share any more, please hop onto our Facebook page and share.
[00:28:38] Speaker A: And we've also got the option to go to our website so you can visit fosteringtogether AU list and you can join our community there. Sign up to our list and we will send you notification of these episodes coming out and on today. What I am going to do, which I haven't told you about, Tracy, is I'm going to do up a little cheat sheet that people can download.
[00:29:01] Speaker B: Well done, Brendan.
[00:29:02] Speaker A: So thank you. I'm a high achiever.
I'm going to create this little cheat sheet on the different types of care that's available and just a few bullet points on what we've got so people can take that away and it might be helpful for them. So if you sign up to the community on that URL, fosteringtogether AU list, you will get a copy of that checklist emailed to your inbox directly the other thing that we will ask you to do, Trace or Tracy said, follow us on our Facebook page also, if you can, please, please, when you listen to this, if our episodes are resonating with you, because these aren't just, we are talking about fostering, but to me, the broader picture of this is parenting. Generally, fostering is parenting. And parenting is a very, very important responsibility for all of us. So I think there's so much that we can learn from anybody. Whether you're caring for children in the foster care system or just through your own parenting, there's always things we can do, pick up from people and try and improve on our parenting. If this resonates, share it with somebody that you know, that you love, you think will get value out of this. And please give us a five star rating on your favourite podcast audio platform and leave us a review if you can. That would be fantastic. And a reminder, again, please share with people in your inner circle and hopefully we can get this podcast out to many, many numbers and we can really grow and build the community moving forward. So we want to thank you again. Thank you for listening. Thanks to our community members on our Facebook page, those that are signed up to the list, we thank you very much. We're honored to humble.
[00:30:40] Speaker B: Absolutely. Thank you very much.
[00:30:42] Speaker A: Tracy signing out. Good night.
[00:30:45] Speaker B: Good night.
[00:30:46] Speaker A: See you soon. Bye.
